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Post by stones1970 on Apr 23, 2018 21:45:45 GMT
Oliver believes better home performances = bigger crowds. Bigger crowds = more income. More income = further ground investment.
All makes sense!
So better home performances means better players (not necessarily more costly). I think they'll be some pretty big team changes next season and clearer expectations of the management and players! I don't think this season's indecision will be repeated.
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Post by cheshiregrandad on Apr 23, 2018 22:21:55 GMT
The comments re a bigger player budget is interesting as we know from the experience of other NL clubs this does not guarantee success.
Surely what is more important is on whom the money is spent. Macclesfield have shown this season what can be achieved. They have one of the smallest playing budgets in the league with one of the smallest squads. Rumour has it locally that the maximum they pay their players is £250 per week.
However what they have developed over the season is a settled, united squad who play their hearts out for each other week in week out and I think this is something Jay should be looking to develop in his squad for next season.
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Post by philosopherstone on Apr 23, 2018 22:58:17 GMT
As supporters the objective should be to try and boost the gate above 3000 regularly toward 3500-4000 which is what is needed to maintain top national side. As for the team - it is clear that the club is not able to pay top full time wages - but as can bee seen by Daggers problems paying £1000 a week is suicide and if this is true clearly a waste of money. We can get the better part time players so maybe this is the way to go. The team lost its spine when Piggott left and I hope that Jay can get the support to rebuild with a strong spine for next season- Good Centre Forward ( with goals) good centre Midfield Playmakers and Big Strong Centre Back. What has been clear this season is that the team has not been big enough, fast enough or smart enough compared to the rest of the league. I do not blame referees although the standard is terrible, with few exceptions. Sadly the team were not quite good enough in key areas, however they were committed and worked hard and cared so thanks are due to them and the management team. Of course we shall all be back next season - C'mon the Stones I don't see a time when our gates could regularly be 3500-4000. I think that's pure fantasy.
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Post by Raymondo316 on Apr 23, 2018 23:11:21 GMT
As supporters the objective should be to try and boost the gate above 3000 regularly toward 3500-4000 which is what is needed to maintain top national side. As for the team - it is clear that the club is not able to pay top full time wages - but as can bee seen by Daggers problems paying £1000 a week is suicide and if this is true clearly a waste of money. We can get the better part time players so maybe this is the way to go. The team lost its spine when Piggott left and I hope that Jay can get the support to rebuild with a strong spine for next season- Good Centre Forward ( with goals) good centre Midfield Playmakers and Big Strong Centre Back. What has been clear this season is that the team has not been big enough, fast enough or smart enough compared to the rest of the league. I do not blame referees although the standard is terrible, with few exceptions. Sadly the team were not quite good enough in key areas, however they were committed and worked hard and cared so thanks are due to them and the management team. Of course we shall all be back next season - C'mon the Stones I don't see a time when our gates could regularly be 3500-4000. I think that's pure fantasy. Only time i could see us averaging that is if we were a League 2 team.
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Post by philosopherstone on Apr 23, 2018 23:22:35 GMT
I don't see a time when our gates could regularly be 3500-4000. I think that's pure fantasy. Only time i could see us averaging that is if we were a League 2 team. I think sometimes we ought to be a little more realistic and indeed thankful for what we have given the past history of this football club. A team back in our home town, in the 5th tier with pretty good gates. Sure I would love to see the Maidstone United captain lifting the European Cup aloft, to add to the trophy cabinet alongside our English Premier League title, but if i'm entirely honest something tells me that might not ever happen.
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Post by nws on Apr 24, 2018 6:31:20 GMT
Only time i could see us averaging that is if we were a League 2 team. I think sometimes we ought to be a little more realistic and indeed thankful for what we have given the past history of this football club. A team back in our home town, in the 5th tier with pretty good gates. Sure I would love to see the Maidstone United captain lifting the European Cup aloft, to add to the trophy cabinet alongside our English Premier League title, but if i'm entirely honest something tells me that might not ever happen. Ahhhh...a fellow realist amongst this board of nonsense and prem style clamourings. Welcome.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2018 11:30:51 GMT
While I welcome the building up of the ground, I do accept some of what Toon said in that he doesn't want to have a great ground in the Conf South. If we need to divert funds to playing staff to cement ourselves in the National then so be it. I welcome the idea that maybe the EFL is a pipe dream at the moment. Maybe we could simply save some budget towards developing the Riverside and do it a bit later, especially as crowds have dropped a bit. It would be depressing to have small crowds rattling around in a 6,000 stadium. The sort of infrastructure I am more interested in would be decent facilities (maybe having proper toilets at the Town End for example). The stadium capacity will not increase when the river side stand is built. Actually the answer to that is 'yes' and 'no'. It won't increase the present technical capacity, but as the FL won't count standing areas in an official capacity, the stand will move us towards meeting FL criteria to the tune of 600.
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Post by royalstone on Apr 24, 2018 13:19:58 GMT
I agree with the concensus that if we stay at our current level for a number of years until the infrastructure of the club is ready to push for promotion to the EFL it would not be a bad thing. However, I think there is an issue that if we aim to finish mid-table/top half we are more likely to end up in a relegation battle than if we are aiming to finish as high as possible, for example lack of ambition could potentially affect player recruitment, players psychology and even attendances which is why I was slightly concerned with some of Oliver's comments.
Obviously I understand the 3g issue needs to be resolved but as it looks like the EFL clubs are not yet ready to vote in favour of allowing 3g I think our priority should be to get the ruling meaning refusing promotion results in double relegation overturned (possibly in court). Also I think we should be lobbying the football authorities for a ruling that in the event of a club with 3g getting promoted to the EFL they should be allowed to keep there pitch for at least 1 maybe 2 seasons. This would address, to some degree, Oliver's concerns that a promoted team could potentially spend a lot of money ripping up there 3g and then get relegated the following season.
If these issues are addressed we can aim to finish as high as possible without any fear and hopefully avoid to many seasons struggling to stay up!
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Post by daveu on Apr 24, 2018 15:32:52 GMT
I agree with the concensus that if we stay at our current level for a number of years until the infrastructure of the club is ready to push for promotion to the EFL it would not be a bad thing. However, I think there is an issue that if we aim to finish mid-table/top half we are more likely to end up in a relegation battle than if we are aiming to finish as high as possible, for example lack of ambition could potentially affect player recruitment, players psychology and even attendances which is why I was slightly concerned with some of Oliver's comments. Obviously I understand the 3g issue needs to be resolved but as it looks like the EFL clubs are not yet ready to vote in favour of allowing 3g I think our priority should be to get the ruling meaning refusing promotion results in double relegation overturned (possibly in court). Also I think we should be lobbying the football authorities for a ruling that in the event of a club with 3g getting promoted to the EFL they should be allowed to keep there pitch for at least 1 maybe 2 seasons. This would address, to some degree, Oliver's concerns that a promoted team could potentially spend a lot of money ripping up there 3g and then get relegated the following season. If these issues are addressed we can aim to finish as high as possible without any fear and hopefully avoid to many seasons struggling to stay up! I think there's a difference between lack of ambition and acceptance of our current level. It's a strange one because you would never go out to do anything other than win every game, while at the same time aiming for a couple of years of consolidation. There are two off-the-field issues currently preventing us being promoted. The first (3G) would currently result in us being relegated if we refuse promotion. However, under current ground grading rules, if we fail to meet the required standard we would simply be ineligible for promotion. It's unlikely, even when the new stand is built, that we would meet the entry criteria for the EFL so the 3G issue isn't going to raise its head, for us at least, for another two or three years at the earliest.
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Post by Nick on Apr 24, 2018 21:36:02 GMT
EFL is not the priority. Staying in the National League is what matters. Oliver knows that clubs that persistently struggle eventually get relegated. So the objective for next season must be to strengthen the squad and improve performances, simply to consolidate our National League status.
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Post by jdl on Apr 24, 2018 23:25:04 GMT
EFL is not the priority. Staying in the National League is what matters. Oliver knows that clubs that persistently struggle eventually get relegated. So the objective for next season must be to strengthen the squad and improve performances, simply to consolidate our National League status. "clubs that persistently struggle eventually get relegated" My thoughts exactly at the end of this season. A poor performance in our first season was acceptable (especially when it was topped and tailed so well), but the sort of ambitionless, meandering, second-rate stuff we've had to watch this season is inexcusable. We have learnt nothing from the first season and very nearly ended up back in the NS. We need a run of seasons where we aren't constantly looking over our shoulders at the relegation spots. Another season like this one and we are deservedly down.
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Post by stonesforlife on Apr 25, 2018 6:10:55 GMT
The comment about Jay, I'm starting to think he may not be here next season, if so I wonder who might be candidates for the post, I would like to see John still if it was the case, knows this league very well.
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Post by pieman1982 on Apr 25, 2018 7:26:01 GMT
I believe Jay is a good manager, however I have been thinking about the chat Lewis and Worgan had with the team before the win against Fylde without Jay and Nicky there! This chat may well have made the difference to the players that sparked that revival. That is troubling in some ways. Has Jay lost the “dressing room” to coin a phrase!? Without the chat from the Captains would we have lost? We know every player in the team is capable they needed more focus and effort as well as confidence, but Jay could not seem to get that out of the team game after game! Now this happened to Mourinho at Chelsea! Great manager who lost the dressing room. For me I would rather see Jay as Manager and a complete rebuild of the squad! Start fresh with new players with Lewis and Worgan at the heart of it.
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Post by spurstone on Apr 25, 2018 8:27:56 GMT
I believe Jay is a good manager, however I have been thinking about the chat Lewis and Worgan had with the team before the win against Fylde without Jay and Nicky there! This chat may well have made the difference to the players that sparked that revival. That is troubling in some ways. Has Jay lost the “dressing room” to coin a phrase!? Without the chat from the Captains would we have lost? We know every player in the team is capable they needed more focus and effort as well as confidence, but Jay could not seem to get that out of the team game after game! Now this happened to Mourinho at Chelsea! Great manager who lost the dressing room. For me I would rather see Jay as Manager and a complete rebuild of the squad! Start fresh with new players with Lewis and Worgan at the heart of it. Any complete squad rebuild can only be with the confidence that the management getting those players in are able to get the absolute best possible out of all those being brought in. Including what makes them tick and what sends them the other way. Otherwise may as well just muddle through, or could be a complete disaster
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Post by steveh21 on Apr 25, 2018 8:42:10 GMT
You have to have ambition to attract good players and more supporters. You can be happy with staying where you are but you cannot then moan when we lose games if the ultimate aim appears to be to stay in the division you are in. Do we get to mid-table safety in February and then do what some clubs do and let all your best players go and save wages to create a war chest for the next season or do you push on? The owners want to be in the EFL so if you get an opportunity for promotion you take it because you never know when that opportunity will come again. That is Sutton's approach. Maidstone United is a bigger club than Dover, Bromley and arguably Sutton so we should be aiming at EFL sooner rather than later but in a sensible way. I see Burton Albion and Yeovil etc as clubs we should be emulating in the medium-term. Perhaps we need more investment into the club so that it does not just fall on Terry and Oliver to finance the ambition. But without ambition what's the point? We used to play Bournemouth and Burnley in Division Four now they are in the Premier League.
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