East Thurrock 3 Maidstone 1

[daveu]

Mar 21, 2014 21:26:29 GMT harryhaddock said:

Mar 21, 2014 9:26:07 GMT tim said:

I would have thought your first point is obvious, if Jay doesn't want them to 'hoof it' maybe he should get the message to the players from the technical area, and if they don't listen, shout at them if they still don't listen, get rid of them
Are we really saying the players don't listen to the manager

The mythical plan B; this is where a manager reviews during a game the tactics, and changes them via substitutions or formations if the original plan isn't working

For example, Dave Anderson Harrow home, 4-1 down tactical change draw 4-4 could have won!

I hope this helps?

I'm clear now, Jay should have stood there shouting and all would have been ok, it's so easy why didn't I think of that!! I never realised football was as simple as the louder the manager shouted the better players play!!

Still you're right I'm sure given he spoke to the players at half time told them to win and they didn't listen and as the 3 changes he made didn't work he should have come in Wednesday and 'got rid' of the 8 players who played poorly and the 3 subs who made no impact. Quick call should do it I'm sure, then he could ring the 11 other players ready and waiting to join us.

And to be clear I understand what plan B is, it's just funny how everyone says Jay should have a plan B, yet never states what they'd have done differently themselves!! Easy to moan, but haven't seen anyone say what they'd have done differently against ETU.....oh sorry I forgot you'd have shouted more!!

Pure class. Nearly choked on my coffee

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[tim]

No harry, you missed the point, if you read my posts I've always said I don’t want another Lloyd Hume, but it would be helpful if he communicated with the players during the game. Not just shout, imo he's too passive and has been said by others looks lacking in passion (which I don't think is true)
Again imo, and held by others he doesn't affect games in progress and neither does his assistant, quite regularly we hoof the ball, but we don’t see signs from the bench to change it, that’s my point!
As for a plan B, you seriously expect a fan to suggest various other plans on a message board?
Do you think we've changed anything tactically, just changed like for like?
He's had this set of players for a while, if they don't listen to him when it should be gradual change
I’m not anti Jay, I like the fella and he's done a good job, but 3 plus seasons in I'm looking for an improvement from him but imo the same mistakes are being made as they were 3 seasons ago when he was rookie
In business if you stand still you go backwards; I see no reason why football should be any different
I'll be there again today cheering Jay and the team as I always do, if you're there come up and have a chat, someone will point you in my direction!
COYS

[harryhaddock]

Mar 22, 2014 9:38:26 GMT tim said:

No harry, you missed the point, if you read my posts I've always said I don’t want another Lloyd Hume, but it would be helpful if he communicated with the players during the game. Not just shout, imo he's too passive and has been said by others looks lacking in passion (which I don't think is true)
Again imo, and held by others he doesn't affect games in progress and neither does his assistant, quite regularly we hoof the ball, but we don’t see signs from the bench to change it, that’s my point!
As for a plan B, you seriously expect a fan to suggest various other plans on a message board?
Do you think we've changed anything tactically, just changed like for like?
He's had this set of players for a while, if they don't listen to him when it should be gradual change
I’m not anti Jay, I like the fella and he's done a good job, but 3 plus seasons in I'm looking for an improvement from him but imo the same mistakes are being made as they were 3 seasons ago when he was rookie
In business if you stand still you go backwards; I see no reason why football should be any different
I'll be there again today cheering Jay and the team as I always do, if you're there come up and have a chat, someone will point you in my direction!
COYS

We're all entitled to our opinions Tim and the beauty of it is we all want what's best for the team so we can agree on that. Unfortunately I can't be there today, but fingers crossed we get off to a good start and don't need to employ Plan B ;-). Look forward to reading thoughts on the game later, fingers crossed for the 3 points, COYS.

[nws]

Mar 21, 2014 12:54:44 GMT daveu said:

Ade, while I'm flattered that you feel the urge to defend me, it's really not necessary. I'm man enough to take the criticism, unlike some on here who start crying every time I disagree with their arguments.

I'm not just defending you but the concept of being able to 'ave a pop'. The evil one known as Tim will see this stopped if he can.

[nws]

Mar 20, 2014 23:15:27 GMT harryhaddock said:

What never ceases to amaze me is this idea that the manager can stop players hoofing a ball etc etc. Once players cross the line it's on them how they play.

As a season ticket holder who's only attended Kingstonian and ETU away games I can only comment on what I've seen, but taking the two away games Jay lined the team up very similarly as outlined below, 442 on both occasions.

Kingstonian - ETU
Worgan - Worgan
Cox - D. Parkinson
Mills - Mills
J Parkinson - Andrews
Sobers - Sobers
Woolery - Hughes-Mason
Brown - Brown
Phillips - Phillips
Flisher - Flisher
Collin - Harris
Attwood - Attwood

First game against the team at the top we won comfortably, second against the team near the bottom we lose convincingly. Jay's fault? How differently did we approach the games, I'm sure simularly. Did he line the team up wrong, don't think so, most would have chosen the same XI.

I'm just not sure what this mystical plan B is to be honest, it's mentioned a lot but no one explains what they would have done differently. Could the dissenters care to enlighten us?!

The difference, given that Kingstonian share with AFCW, was probably the pitch. I didn't go to either game so don't know but I'll wager we played passing football at Kingstonian and hoofed it at ETU. Of the differences in the two line-u[s it would be worth noting that at Kingstonian we played with one player at centre back with reasonable passing ability (Parkinson) but with two centre backs more likely to knock it longer at ETU. At Kingstonian we also played with only one aerial threat forward (Attwood). At ETU we played with two. Hence, the two line-ups were quite different in that we had a greater likelihood of passing it out from the back at Kingstonian and a greater likelihood of relying on aerial threat at ETU.

If Plan A is hoof it then mythical plan B is full backs or centre backs dropping to collect the ball from the goalie, passing to midfielders who then look to work it forward and set up goal scoring opportunities for the forwards. Plan A was espoused by Charlie Hughes in the 1950s after a study of where Division 1 goals came come from. Plan B was espoused by Charlie Hughes' nemesis (and my footballing hero) Brian Clough.

Hope that helps, Mr Haddock