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Post by OldBoy73 on Jan 21, 2020 8:14:50 GMT
They look pretty scary to me...….you cant tell me they aren't easy pickings for being infiltrated by nutters with other agendas that aren't peaceful or law abiding...….! I guess there is always that worry. On that front, I would respectively suggest that our government and the US government should be listed as well. After all, Extinction Rebellion havent, to date, sold arms to middle eastern despots or heightened the possibility of war in the middle east. I think the scary looking thing is a deliberate tactic to shock people into getting the message. Or to hide their identities from the authorities? Like the KKK? You shouldn't have to scare people to make your point. I wouldn't let my young kids anywhere near that bunch of scary looking extras from a horror movie, it would give them nightmares. Surely if your protecting a beautiful planet that's what your imagery should be? No, they are scary, and back to my original point, dressed like that will DEFINITELY attract angry people just looking for a cause to be angry about who don't really care what the cause is as long as they can have a rant and a riot. Im glad the authorities are keeping an eye on them! |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2020 14:31:38 GMT
It's like being back in the 70s on this thresd.
Oh, Jeremy Corbyn...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2020 17:23:37 GMT
I guess there is always that worry. On that front, I would respectively suggest that our government and the US government should be listed as well. After all, Extinction Rebellion havent, to date, sold arms to middle eastern despots or heightened the possibility of war in the middle east. I think the scary looking thing is a deliberate tactic to shock people into getting the message. Or to hide their identities from the authorities? Like the KKK? You shouldn't have to scare people to make your point. I wouldn't let my young kids anywhere near that bunch of scary looking extras from a horror movie, it would give them nightmares. Surely if your protecting a beautiful planet that's what your imagery should be? No, they are scary, and back to my original point, dressed like that will DEFINITELY attract angry people just looking for a cause to be angry about who don't really care what the cause is as long as they can have a rant and a riot. Im glad the authorities are keeping an eye on them! If you write definitely in capitals it won't make it true you know.😂😂 People dress up in costumes like that all the time (Halloween?) and we don't assume they are nutters looking for trouble. One hallmark of the XR protests has been their general peacefulness towards people (the police have said that). Compare that to attending football matches. I'm sure there will be examples where this has not been the case but for a huge worldwide movement it is pretty good. Whether we will see environmental terrorism in the future remains to be seen. I hope not but the reality is that people have been protesting in the nice Miss Marpleesque way you describe and it hasn't got them anywhere at all, despite the overwhelming backing of scientists and experts on the matter. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2020 17:29:38 GMT
So the economists you all keep slating as being wrong have this time got it right. Thank goodness. I'm not sure if the article eventually mentions that this only applies if we get a deal. It's not in any headline or sub-headline and isn't in anything in the first two or three paragraphs What happens after this hallowed two years? This year nothing will change while negotiations take place and most economists will be aware of lagging factors. So what you are really saying here is that for 3 years we will be outpacing the eurozone. For one year we were still in the EU, for another we were out but nothing had been changed and for the third we were adjusting to our new status. Yes. Pure proof of the success of brexit |
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Post by distantfan on Jan 22, 2020 0:51:33 GMT
'Outpace' is an exaggeration. The IMF report predicts the UK economy will outperform the EU by 0.1% in both years. Even this is heavily qualified: "The growth forecast assumes an orderly exit from the European Union at the end of January followed by a gradual transition to a new economic relationship." www.imf.org/en/Publications/WEO/Issues/2020/01/20/weo-update-january2020 |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 0:56:27 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 1:10:34 GMT
'Outpace' is an exaggeration. The IMF report predicts the UK economy will outperform the EU by 0.1% in both years. Even this is heavily qualified: "The growth forecast assumes an orderly exit from the European Union at the end of January followed by a gradual transition to a new economic relationship." www.imf.org/en/Publications/WEO/Issues/2020/01/20/weo-update-january2020 Here is what the IMF says about the UK estimate. The FT reports about the IMF's reluctance to make projections for the UK. The Johnson-employing Telegraph didn't report this. How remiss... "There is substantial uncertainty around the baseline projection of about 1.5 percent growth in the United Kingdom in 2019-20. The unchanged projection relative to the October 2018 WEO reflects the offsetting negative effect of prolonged uncertainty about the Brexit outcome and the positive impact from fiscal stimulus announced in the 2019 budget. This baseline projection assumes that a Brexit deal is reached in 2019 and that the UK transitions gradually to the new regime. However, as of mid-January, the shape that Brexit will ultimately take remains highly uncertain" |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 4:14:06 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 7:13:59 GMT
All depends where the jobs were created and whether or not they were full time and well paid. Already we are seeing the potential Northern Powerhouse being denied HS2, despite all the promises about investment going there, while the government were happy to bail out Flybe, but let Thomas Cook go to the wall.
It is possible to spin almost anything. My favourite was the announcements in the Thatcher years that the rate at which unemployment was increasing had fallen. Still going up, but made it sound like it wasn't.
Miserable enough?!?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 7:52:00 GMT
All depends where the jobs were created and whether or not they were full time and well paid. Already we are seeing the potential Northern Powerhouse being denied HS2, despite all the promises about investment going there, while the government were happy to bail out Flybe, but let Thomas Cook go to the wall. It is possible to spin almost anything. My favourite was the announcements in the Thatcher years that the rate at which unemployment was increasing had fallen. Still going up, but made it sound like it wasn't. Miserable enough?!? They used to change the way unemployment was measured every few years, so by the end of Thatcher's time we had no real idea how unemployment figures compared to those when she took over. I'm pretty sure that they passed 3 million at one stage though, and that's a lot whichever way you're measuring it Before she became Prime Minister, Thatcher once had a go at the Labour administration over their unemployment figures, which were approaching 1m at the time, claiming that she would never be Prime Minister with over a million unemployed. Although, I suppose in a way she was right - it was many times that for most of her time. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 7:59:26 GMT
All depends where the jobs were created and whether or not they were full time and well paid. Already we are seeing the potential Northern Powerhouse being denied HS2, despite all the promises about investment going there, while the government were happy to bail out Flybe, but let Thomas Cook go to the wall. It is possible to spin almost anything. My favourite was the announcements in the Thatcher years that the rate at which unemployment was increasing had fallen. Still going up, but made it sound like it wasn't. Miserable enough?!? They used to do the same with inflation, which was in silly figures in those days (we used to get two pay rises a year to try to keep up). The government would frequently trumpet the fact that the rate of increase had gone down, whilst the actual rate had of course gone up. I remember one MP claiming that inflation was under control as it had fallen by some ridiculous figure like 30 or 40%, when, of course, it was the the difference in the rate of increase between one month and the next he was talking about. In reality, actual inflation had risen once again. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 11:24:57 GMT
So now you are celebrating jobs created while we are still in the EU as proof that it is going to be great to leave? OK Rising employment should be a good thing. However, I am concerned that worker protections are going to be eroded through the deal Johnson has negotiated and that many jobs are/will be poorly paid and insecure. That might not be the case now but it is my concern going forward. Why else would workers protections have been removed from the withdrawal agreement to political declaration. I might also get you to note the employment lagging effect before posting your diatribe. When you need to look at employment to determine how things are going is around a year or more after we actually leave (i.e. we stop shadowing EU policy/regs) As for being a miserabilist. I think that was the architects of Brexit who, when things were OK, kept telling us our lives were awful and that foreign guy over there was stealing your job/lowering your wage, taking your house, clogging up your hospital etc etc. I must admit I get confused between whether that is miserablim or the original Project Fear. Anyway, I thought you wanted to change the subject. Amazing how you claim that while simultaneously keep stoking the argument. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 11:41:45 GMT
So now you are celebrating jobs created while we are still in the EU as proof that it is going to be great to leave? OK Rising employment should be a good thing. However, I am concerned that worker protections are going to be eroded through the deal Johnson has negotiated and that many jobs are/will be poorly paid and insecure. That might not be the case now but it is my concern going forward. Why else would workers protections have been removed from the withdrawal agreement to political declaration. I might also get you to note the employment lagging effect before posting your diatribe. When you need to look at employment to determine how things are going is around a year or more after we actually leave (i.e. we stop shadowing EU policy/regs) As for being a miserabilist. I think that was the architects of Brexit who, when things were OK, kept telling us our lives were awful and that foreign guy over there was stealing your job/lowering your wage, taking your house, clogging up your hospital etc etc. I must admit I get confused between whether that is miserablim or the original Project Fear. Anyway, I thought you wanted to change the subject. Amazing how you claim that while simultaneously keep stoking the argument. Surely a lot of jobs will become vacant when EU nationals drift off back home because they cannot be bothered applying for visas. These jobs will have to be filled by someone but if they offer shit money and awful terms and conditions then their vacancies will never get filled. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 12:50:57 GMT
So now you are celebrating jobs created while we are still in the EU as proof that it is going to be great to leave? OK Rising employment should be a good thing. However, I am concerned that worker protections are going to be eroded through the deal Johnson has negotiated and that many jobs are/will be poorly paid and insecure. That might not be the case now but it is my concern going forward. Why else would workers protections have been removed from the withdrawal agreement to political declaration. I might also get you to note the employment lagging effect before posting your diatribe. When you need to look at employment to determine how things are going is around a year or more after we actually leave (i.e. we stop shadowing EU policy/regs) As for being a miserabilist. I think that was the architects of Brexit who, when things were OK, kept telling us our lives were awful and that foreign guy over there was stealing your job/lowering your wage, taking your house, clogging up your hospital etc etc. I must admit I get confused between whether that is miserablim or the original Project Fear. Anyway, I thought you wanted to change the subject. Amazing how you claim that while simultaneously keep stoking the argument. Surely a lot of jobs will become vacant when EU nationals drift off back home because they cannot be bothered applying for visas. These jobs will have to be filled by someone but if they offer shit money and awful terms and conditions then their vacancies will never get filled. You may be entirely correct, however, I rather fear your somewhat simplistic analysis may be another red herring provided by the elitists that, IMO, persuaded you to vote for their enrichment. Many of the people going home are more likely to be vibrant and dynamic younger people that create demand by being active and doing and consuming things. We have an ageing population ourselves which is less likely to create demand as much. I would also point out that firms may choose to relocate to places in the EU so they can trade with the EU more easily. At this point they may provide goods and services to meet demand but the jobs will shift elsewhere (it is why I keep banging on about Rees-Mogg and Dyson being hypocritical because they tell us to believe in Brexit while simultaneously opening up ventures abroad that allow them to trade with the EU). If this latter point were true we would be haemorrhaging dosh. One method of stopping this is to lower worker protections (see point re Johnson moving workers protections to political declaration from withdrawal agreement) and get us competing on price. Obviously this could mean the poor money and terms you so despise. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 12:55:15 GMT
Anyway, enough Brexit. I lost and need to move on. It is all for the Brexit voters. Whatever happens now it's not my fault. It is theirs. news.trust.org/item/20200121232717-pehji/Is this a step in the right direction or a pointless waste of time and too little too late? |
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