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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2014 21:47:11 GMT
Why are we (England/The FA/fans) so desperate to find an excuse for the simple fact that our players are simply not good enough at the moment
Changing the league they play in once they get to 18 years old will not make a jot of difference.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2014 21:54:45 GMT
Personally I think it's a cracking idea. Like it says, there will be an improvement in home-grown players by putting bans on the number of non-Europeans in each side. Not only that, but this could also decrease the amount of money some clubs splash on players as it makes it easier for clubs to 'steal' from the B team. It's successful in the Spanish, Italian and Portugese league, why not here?
It is the way forward - along with 3G.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2014 21:58:02 GMT
What would Chelsea under 21s learn from playing Alfreton or Gateshead? Preposterous idea.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2014 22:03:06 GMT
What would Chelsea under 21s learn from playing Alfreton or Gateshead? Preposterous idea. They'll learn the physical side of the game. Toughen them up a bit. Not only that, but then when/if they get promoted, they get to test every single standard and quality of football in England apart from the Prem. By that time, they might have even got a first team call up?
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2014 22:03:28 GMT
What would Chelsea under 21s learn from playing Alfreton or Gateshead? Preposterous idea. If they learn nothing why are these players currently loaned out to these clubs for match experience / fitness? I accept it helps the wage bill but not really an issue for top flight clubs
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Post by ontheup on May 8, 2014 22:04:52 GMT
Bonkers indeed they will be wanting to play on grass next. How long did it take to get a pyramid system ? This is all for the benefit of the big boys ? If you want to improve the number of english players we must stop the influx of ordinary journey man players from abroad, foreign owners who have no consideration for fans and tradition, and get some proper english managers and coaches that send teams out to win by playing positive, exciting, attacking football. 3g pitches where kids can be taught the skills they need, the time should be spent with a bias towards skills training rather than game after game. Our kids are burnt out before they peak if they are good they can end up playing for club, school, district, kent, soccer elite, psa and when they get home they go down the field with thier mates. Players on 300k moan if they have 2 games a week some of our kids can end up playing 3 games in a weekend at a critical stage of thier physical development. Some talking points please debate ! Well I'm quite positive about today's announcement, not because I agree with the proposals but because less than 2 weeks ago I'm sure a number of conference board members raised a glass in celebration at us not making the play offs. I'm sure they slept well that night knowing the 3G debate had gone away for a few months, they buried their heads in the sand, even when asked to reconsider by Greg Dyke and the Minister for Sport. Tonight, I'm guessing 3G pitches are the least of their problems and now they really have got to "protect" their members.....and they can't even offer their members the opportunity to vote.....not even each Conf prem club has it's own vote and the north and south get 4 each.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2014 22:16:54 GMT
Personally I think it's a cracking idea. Like it says, there will be an improvement in home-grown players by putting bans on the number of non-Europeans in each side. Not only that, but this could also decrease the amount of money some clubs splash on players as it makes it easier for clubs to 'steal' from the B team. It's successful in the Spanish, Italian and Portugese league, why not here? It is the way forward - along with 3G. Bans on the numbers of non Europeans? I thought it was a ban on non Europeans, with restrictions on the number of non home grown players. It'll do nothing but make the premier league sides richer and force little clubs to the wall. Fans who only watch their "proper" team at home then watch their local side the next week will instead go and watch their "proper b" team. This is not an issue in Spain/Italy/Portugal because their lower leagues are not as well supported in the first place.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2014 22:18:51 GMT
Personally I think it's a cracking idea. Like it says, there will be an improvement in home-grown players by putting bans on the number of non-Europeans in each side. Not only that, but this could also decrease the amount of money some clubs splash on players as it makes it easier for clubs to 'steal' from the B team. It's successful in the Spanish, Italian and Portugese league, why not here? It is the way forward - along with 3G. Bans on the numbers of non Europeans? I thought it was a ban on non Europeans, with restrictions on the number of non home grown players. It'll do nothing but make the premier league sides richer and force little clubs to the wall. Fans who only watch their "proper" team at home then watch their local side the next week will instead go and watch their "proper b" team. This is not an issue in Spain/Italy/Portugal because their lower leagues are not as well supported in the first place. Watch this space.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2014 22:21:27 GMT
What the... A well constructed, thought out piece of sense from heathside?
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2014 22:57:18 GMT
Oh bore off cleanshirt
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Post by jdl on May 8, 2014 23:35:42 GMT
After further consideration, my opinion on this has altered. I no longer thin it is bonkers, it is clearly raving lunacy.
For a start - only 10 PL 'B' teams. How will they select the 10, and what will the other 10 clubs do?
Then there is the question of promotion - B teams in the new League 3 can be promoted as far as League 1 (assuming their parent club stays in the PL). These teams will consists of PL squad players - players capable of playing at PL level, but not currently good/consistent enough to be selected regularly. In other words, players of lower level PL or, at least, Championship quality. They will wipe the floor with Conference teams.
So, in 5 years time, all the PL 'B' sides will have been promoted (and will eventually work their way up to League One, which will then become the 'half 'propper' sides/half reserve sides league' that the proposed League 3 is supposed to be) and League 3 will consist entirely of ex-League sides and clubs promoted from non-league football - in other words exactly like the existing Conference Premier!
And then there is the old 'League Cup' problem - how to prevent PL sides simply drafting in first team players for important games (or pulling them out at the last minute from games that 'don't matter').
So, what have we gained? The opportunity to see some PL standard football at the Gallagher, maybe (and our side regularly thrashed), but no chance at all of any non-league sides being promoted for at least 5 years. And when the dust has died down, everything is as it was, just with a different name. We could have that now, without all the fuss, by just renaming the Conference Premier 'League Three'.
But what about the idea of giving the PL reserve sides some real, competitive football? Well, here's a radical suggestion - form a PL reserve league. That way, the PL standard teams get to play regular, meaningful, competitive games against other PL standard teams every week. Now why has no one thought of that?
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Post by ipswichstoneden on May 8, 2014 23:47:22 GMT
"But what about the idea of giving the PL reserve sides some real, competitive football? Well, here's a radical suggestion - form a PL reserve league. That way, the PL standard teams get to play regular, meaningful, competitive games against other PL standard teams every week. Now why has no one thought of that?"
Thats too sensible John! There was a Premier League reserve league a few years ago. It should be brought back along with the Football Combination. Should never have got rid of it. They would rather disrupt the pyramid that people worked so hard to achieve in the first place.
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2014 6:50:11 GMT
I think the point is the premier reserve league is not "real competitive football".
My idea would be allow Premier league sides to send there younfer players to lower league sides on a temporary basis to play for them for real competitive football.
It's radical I know
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Post by russc on May 9, 2014 7:39:36 GMT
There's been a lot of comment about limiting the number of foreign players in the Premier League, which seems to suggest that England were world beaters in the 70s and 80s when there were pretty much no overseas players playing here. Anyone recall those golden days? It's also been suggested that this League 3 would be good because it would give lads a chance to "toughen up". Somehow I doubt the coaching emphasis in other countries is dedicated to toughening up players, or teaching them how to belt the ball and run after it, like it so often seems to be here.
We wouldn't need to limit the number of overseas players if we were producing talent with the requisite skills and with a realistic expectation of what they should be paid. It might help if, instead of having Premier League B teams, there was some sort of decent return for lower league clubs when they develop players that move to Premier League clubs. I also wonder if the figures for UEFA Elite qualified coaches might shed light on why we aren't producing enough good players of our own. Let's take a look (figures from Oct 2013):
Spain 12,700 Germany 5,500 England 1,161
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Post by tooloow on May 9, 2014 9:10:36 GMT
For a start - only 10 PL 'B' teams. How will they select the 10, and what will the other 10 clubs do? The report (page 65) answers this:
- Should more than ten Premier League clubs want and be eligible for a B team in 2016-17, further B teams would initially play in the Conference Premier in that season.
So I guess that if 20 PL B Teams are wanted, then that's 6-10 teams in the Conference that would be relegated (they discuss the option of increasing League 3 to 24 teams if demand dictates) and that extra relegation would be forced down through the pyramid? Although they also state that: -By creating spaces within the current footballing pyramid, no clubs would be displaced by this system.
They also pass the buck a bit on this by saying: - The eventual structure and distribution of B teams would clearly be a decision for the clubs in the Football League and the Conference.
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