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Post by pwoodstone on Nov 17, 2024 9:05:58 GMT
This club have no ambition and I think that’s exactly why George will be backed. He’s not good enough to push for promotion so fits well with the owners vision. At least other non league clubs who has the FA cup success we did used the money which ultimately rejected them upwards (Sutton etc). Couldn't agree more. The FA Cup money was the chance to really try and take a step upwards and try to be more than mediocre, but yet again there isn't any desire from the owners to speculate to accumulate; the club seem to think they can pay £25 a week and get Ronaldo, when the reality is to get Ronaldo you need to pay Ronaldo money. If mediocre and a sound business is their goal - they are the owners and it's their business so they are entitled to run it as they wish. However they should be honest with the fans - Terry Casey talks about wanting to be a National League club which on the basis of what anyone with eyes can see is an utter lie. The problem with football is that you can spend spend spend to achieve a promotion but if you do go up, you are effectively starting again. You have less money and all you are is in the higher league with even more expense. We could burn through £400k of of the money and be in the NL but back with our normal lower budget (unless the owners want to throw in more of their own money) and then in a years time be back in the NLS with nothing to show for it. Like Ebbsfleet basically. The perfect example. It’s like winning £250k on the lottery and some people spending it on a a year of holidays and eating in expensive restaurants and the ones who spend it on a house. I am sure Terry wants to be in the NL but on the budget we can afford. If that doesn’t happen then that’s a shame. |
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Benny
Junior Member
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Post by Benny on Nov 17, 2024 9:16:03 GMT
Every club finds its level eventually. This is ours for now. Ebbsfleet will probably be rejoining us again soon.
Clubs sometimes fall below their level, like Dulwich. Or fail to reach their potential, like Chatham, for now. But it usually balances out in the end.
We’ve stolen plenty of players from clubs below without their fans having a meltdown. It’s part and parcel of football at this level.
Loads of teams were knocked out yesterday by clubs below them in the pyramid. It happens every single year, and we do it to bigger clubs regularly in the FA Cup.
Take a chill pill and move on. We will still have a club to support for years to come.
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Post by OldBoy73 on Nov 17, 2024 15:49:04 GMT
Every club finds its level eventually. This is ours for now. Ebbsfleet will probably be rejoining us again soon. Clubs sometimes fall below their level, like Dulwich. Or fail to reach their potential, like Chatham, for now. But it usually balances out in the end. We’ve stolen plenty of players from clubs below without their fans having a meltdown. It’s part and parcel of football at this level. Loads of teams were knocked out yesterday by clubs below them in the pyramid. It happens every single year, and we do it to bigger clubs regularly in the FA Cup. Take a chill pill and move on. We will still have a club to support for years to come. Don’t disagree Benny but we still shouldn’t have lost at Horsham and certainly not in the way we did and disappointment is natural. |
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Post by edos78 on Nov 17, 2024 18:43:48 GMT
damning that we didn't get the signing done earlier - the player was at the club an initial agreement was in place we don't behave like a club of the size we are Why don’t support a club whose ethos more closely matches your own sense of entitlement. we both know that's not really how it works Dave - I watched my first Maidstone game in 1990 so I'm a little long in the tooth to change now. and anyway, this is not about entitlement. I really don't expect promotion - but I do want to see players, performances and some results that are comparable to our resources, particularly at this level. Right now we are underdelivering on all three and don't seem to operate like a club of the size we are. Smaller clubs are doing more with much less. It's not just about money. Comparable (and perhaps smaller) clubs like Worthing, Eastbourne, Dorking and even Truro have a clear and stated objective to win promotion this season (not to mention Torquay and Boreham Wood). We don't and I don't think it helps us - it all feels a little "that'll do" - you can feel it in the atmosphere at The Gallagher, the fans are not on board. We have too many players who wouldn't get close to the first teams of many other clubs in the league - I don't think its disputed that the squad is weaker than last season (particularly up front) and I'm not sure why. It just shouldn't be. Final point, I have been lucky to have worked with a number of Premier League & Championship clubs. I always think of Norwich City - they have a core objective that runs through the entire club - which is to finish as a top 26 club. They don't expect to be in the PL, but when they aren't the minimum standard is top 6 of the championship. If they fail to meet that - they're not happy and they make changes. Palace had the same ethos and it set them up to establish themselves in the PL. I think something similar is right for us e.g. finish as a top 28 non league club - we did it last season, feels like we are falling short right now - so change is needed I hope it happens, but I'm not feeling particularly confident that it will p.s. my comment about news this week was about the incoming players, not the Blair leaving rumour |
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Post by Dan on Nov 18, 2024 7:42:33 GMT
Too gloomy assessment by far Mr Scrooge.
So you feel like we won't make the play-offs and therefore changes are required ?
Your may have delivered a seriously studied analysis of the season so far, but the fact that you have responded immediately after a Trophy defeat, suggests it's knee-jerkish.
More recent league performances and results do demonstrate that Stones are heading in the right direction, looking very much like play-off candidates.
Still 3 or 4 quality signings in midfield and up front needed by January, preferably sooner please George.
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Post by edos78 on Nov 18, 2024 8:19:42 GMT
Too gloomy assessment by far Mr Scrooge. So you feel like we won't make the play-offs and therefore changes are required ? Your may have delivered a seriously studied analysis of the season so far, but the fact that you have responded immediately after a Trophy defeat, suggests it's knee-jerkish. More recent league performances and results do demonstrate that Stones are heading in the right direction, looking very much like play-off candidates. Still 3 or 4 quality signings in midfield and up front needed by January, preferably sooner please George. You've said that 4 quality signings are needed, so it seems you agree that changes are needed too. This discussion started before Saturday and the Trophy game hasn't changed my view, but I do think it validates it. Possibly my biggest frustration overall is the style of football. I've seen 90% of the games under George and I think there have been around 7 genuinely good performances in the league in that time. We have had a decent run of form in the NLS but even the recent home wins have been a hard watch - curiously the the 2nd half at Dorking with 10 men was probably the best. But our attacking play overall really isn't very good. The second frustration is with the quality of the squad, which does link to the Horsham game. It just isn't good enough for a club of our size. There was a lot of optimism in the summer, but currently we are a lot weaker than last year. We had much better players through the squad then - Covolan, Hoyte, Appiah, Agympong, Sole, Ade-Poku, Tanga, Amantchi, Rush & Faal - perhaps Ezennolim, Bone, Klass, Petrasso & Reynolds too. I'm not shouting 'Ash out' or suggesting we change manager, but I think its reasonable to think some quite big improvements are needed. |
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Post by pwoodstone on Nov 18, 2024 12:20:49 GMT
Too gloomy assessment by far Mr Scrooge. So you feel like we won't make the play-offs and therefore changes are required ? Your may have delivered a seriously studied analysis of the season so far, but the fact that you have responded immediately after a Trophy defeat, suggests it's knee-jerkish. More recent league performances and results do demonstrate that Stones are heading in the right direction, looking very much like play-off candidates. Still 3 or 4 quality signings in midfield and up front needed by January, preferably sooner please George. You've said that 4 quality signings are needed, so it seems you agree that changes are needed too. This discussion started before Saturday and the Trophy game hasn't changed my view, but I do think it validates it. Possibly my biggest frustration overall is the style of football. I've seen 90% of the games under George and I think there have been around 7 genuinely good performances in the league in that time. We have had a decent run of form in the NLS but even the recent home wins have been a hard watch - curiously the the 2nd half at Dorking with 10 men was probably the best. But our attacking play overall really isn't very good. The second frustration is with the quality of the squad, which does link to the Horsham game. It just isn't good enough for a club of our size. There was a lot of optimism in the summer, but currently we are a lot weaker than last year. We had much better players through the squad then - Covolan, Hoyte, Appiah, Agympong, Sole, Ade-Poku, Tanga, Amantchi, Rush & Faal - perhaps Bone, Klass, Petrasso & Reynolds too. I'm not shouting 'Ash out' or suggesting we change manager, but I think its reasonable to think some quite big improvements are needed. I would agree non the performance part. We are a hard watch and even when we are dominating parts of the game, we are not making keepers make saves. Even against Hornchurch, we sat back last 20 minutes and played on the counter. Last season we did it over and over again when going ahead. I think the first XI is stronger and starting to gel and missing ( I would have said one missing pieces but now two). The squad is much weaker though, not helped with injuries that's true. We need to get some quality in, I think we can all agree on that. I expect and hope it is being looked at and this result can only have strengthened that. You can tell from the story from GE this morning that he knows it isn't good enough and that supporters don't think it is.
Everyone seems to agree on a lot of the points being made.
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Post by jdl on Nov 18, 2024 15:15:30 GMT
Horsham was dire. But then so was Chelmsford, and we recovered from that, and have gone eight games without losing since.
And the two games aren't really comparable. Chelmsford was out of nowhere, just 'one of those', not typical of how we were playing. Whereas Horsham had some obvious (and hopefully one-off) causes - loss of key defender (obvious replacement unavailable), unexpected loss of key midfielder (with no time to adjust), and a serious cock-up in the strategy department. And, of course, it was a cup game, and, for every Ipswich, there will always be several Horshams...
So, I would expect us to pretty much continue where we left off in the league. And, if we do that, with the 'standard' of the league this season, we stand a pretty good chance of making the play-offs. If we win both our games in hand, we are there or thereabouts already, and even if we just do the usual and throw 2 points away with one of them, we're still 10th, and only one win away.
But then, the problem isn't really the play-offs, we are a big NS club, with much better resources than most, we really ought to be in the play-offs most seasons. The problem is if we go up. There's no way the current squad would survive in the NL - anyone who was at Solihull will tell you that. So that would mean yet another major rebuild in the summer, this time with even more difficulty. We may be a big club in the NL, but we are a minnow in the NL.
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Post by theguvnor on Nov 18, 2024 15:15:39 GMT
The problem is whether we replace Benton with; will also probably be a loanee, as we are never going to show the initiative other teams around us have in signing a player to be here for future. Let’s face it, Georges overall judgement on players is more miss than hit
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Post by jdl on Nov 18, 2024 15:27:57 GMT
The problem is whether we replace Benton with; will also probably be a loanee, as we are never going to show the initiative other teams around us have in signing a player to be here for future. Let’s face it, Georges overall judgement on players is more miss than hit That's hardly fair. It's certainly hit AND miss, but this is only his second season, and not many brand new managers start at this level. He's actually done pretty well (play-offs and the 5th round in his first season, after all!). This season's not been so good, but he's still done OK with the limited resources he has. His problem is not so much not finding the right players, it's either the right players aren't available (except on loan), or he can find them, but we can't keep them. Clubs like Worthing, Dorking, Boreham Wood and Torquay all have better resources than us, so that's 4 play-off places gone for a start. If he gets us to the play-offs (for the second time in just two seasons), he's done pretty well. And, if he was any better, we wouldn't be able to keep him, anyway! |
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Post by dweezil on Nov 18, 2024 17:23:15 GMT
The problem is whether we replace Benton with; will also probably be a loanee, as we are never going to show the initiative other teams around us have in signing a player to be here for future. Let’s face it, Georges overall judgement on players is more miss than hit That's hardly fair. It's certainly hit AND miss, but this is only his second season, and not many brand new managers start at this level. He's actually done pretty well (play-offs and the 5th round in his first season, after all!). This season's not been so good, but he's still done OK with the limited resources he has. His problem is not so much not finding the right players, it's either the right players aren't available (except on loan), or he can find them, but we can't keep them. Clubs like Worthing, Dorking, Boreham Wood and Torquay all have better resources than us, so that's 4 play-off places gone for a start. If he gets us to the play-offs (for the second time in just two seasons), he's done pretty well. And, if he was any better, we wouldn't be able to keep him, anyway! |
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Post by edos78 on Nov 18, 2024 18:08:51 GMT
That's hardly fair. It's certainly hit AND miss, but this is only his second season, and not many brand new managers start at this level. He's actually done pretty well (play-offs and the 5th round in his first season, after all!). This season's not been so good, but he's still done OK with the limited resources he has. His problem is not so much not finding the right players, it's either the right players aren't available (except on loan), or he can find them, but we can't keep them. Clubs like Worthing, Dorking, Boreham Wood and Torquay all have better resources than us, so that's 4 play-off places gone for a start. If he gets us to the play-offs (for the second time in just two seasons), he's done pretty well. And, if he was any better, we wouldn't be able to keep him, anyway! I'm not sure Dorking & Worthing do have better resources than us - but I think they are better run on the football side with clear ambition |
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Post by dweezil on Nov 18, 2024 18:10:36 GMT
Loan players can cause problems of their own - particularly strikers. If you get an impact attacker who scores 6 in 6, the parent club wakes up and demands another look at you. If you don't score any, neither club is interested in keeping you.
Having said that, Levi and (possibly now JB has gone) Rushy must be in the mind of George.
Neither are currently getting game time and it's usually about this time of year that EFL2/NL are willing to offload and upgrade, possibly at the expense of the top NLS/NLN attacking options at the time going the other way
We desperately need to be less sterile and purely methodical in our offensive set up
I don't often agree with Marc White at Dorking, but this time he is spot on when he recently said that you win leagues by scoring goals, not keeping clean sheets
Take note George, take the handbrake off and in the words of Jean Luc Picard - make it Feckin so
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Post by jackster on Nov 18, 2024 18:41:21 GMT
Did someone say they are not sure if Dorking Wanderers has more resources than MUFC.
SERIOUSLY ?
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Post by pwoodstone on Nov 18, 2024 18:59:54 GMT
When we were there in the playoffs semi (Worthing), one of their fans was telling me that they've become self sufficient and are a well run club. Some debt in the club that they are clearing and not over spending.
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