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Post by Raymondo316 on Nov 15, 2024 16:07:08 GMT
Just 6 months ago he played in the playoff final for Solihull and even took a penalty, Solihull fans all seemed to rate him as well, so no I don't think it's a case that he isn't good enough for the National League.
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Post by Harry on Nov 15, 2024 16:23:51 GMT
this isn't about entitlement, it's entirely reasonable for fans to want to see on field success and I'd suggest most do this club has one of the largest supports in non league and far from the lowest season ticket and match day prices - our financial performance is strong, even before we consider the FA Cup income and Amantchi transfer fee I was a regular at Watling St, and no one wants to see the club put at risk again but it would be good to see us punch our weight occasionally, rather than being 'gas lit' that we can't (and particularly as it seems the Benton transfer wasn't actually just about money) You say our financial performance is strong. Well our income covers our expenditure if that's what you mean. To increase the playing budget further would simply run the club into deficit or increase the level of debt through loans from the current owners (which isn't going to happen). 'Punching our weight' is exactly what the club does, not occasionally but all the time. |
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joe
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Post by joe on Nov 15, 2024 16:27:22 GMT
I think some of our support believe than spending more than we earn is the panacea of success.
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Post by Terry on Nov 15, 2024 16:33:34 GMT
Everybody wants success but it means different things to different people.
In the early days when the Stones were all conquering in lower leagues, our resources dwarfed that of other clubs.
So we won plenty of matches and gained successive promotions.
Happy days.
But we've found a natural sort of level, doing well in the NLS and/or struggling in the National League.
Our financial resources don't allow for another £250,000/£500,000 on the playing bill any time soon.
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Post by pwoodstone on Nov 15, 2024 16:33:50 GMT
The same old arguments will surface.
Look at our attendance versus Boreham Wood and other teams above us.
Where’s the £800k from the cup run.
County town of Kent etc etc.
I don’t have the energy to defend the owners when I don’t even know the facts and would be presuming a whole lot. Anyone can read our accounts and they are a tad confusing because of the multi company set up.
Ultimately the fans have a certain ambition, the owners is below that. Likely because they don’t want to lose any more of their money in a club they are looking to sell some or all of.
It is what it is. The fans acceptance of it will depend on results and who comes in to fill the gaps and this new gap.
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Post by pwoodstone on Nov 15, 2024 16:34:34 GMT
Just 6 months ago he played in the playoff final for Solihull and even took a penalty, Solihull fans all seemed to rate him as well, so no I don't think it's a case that he isn't good enough for the National League. He’s quality. Anyone can see that. What his ceiling is largely irrelevant as he was one of our best players and that all that matters |
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Post by jdl on Nov 15, 2024 16:39:09 GMT
Not sure it is exactly damning of our set up? Boreham Wood still have their deal with Arsenal ladies - albeit diluted from how it was & they’ve always been willing to throw money around - if it had been any other team at this level in for Benton I imagine he’d still be here until January minimum. It is what it is, there’ll always be a team splashing the cash recklessly and it ain’t ever going to be Maidstone United with the current owners - at least we know where we stand. Amen to that. One Jim Thompson in a life-time is one too many. |
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Post by edos78 on Nov 15, 2024 16:43:35 GMT
this isn't about entitlement, it's entirely reasonable for fans to want to see on field success and I'd suggest most do this club has one of the largest supports in non league and far from the lowest season ticket and match day prices - our financial performance is strong, even before we consider the FA Cup income and Amantchi transfer fee I was a regular at Watling St, and no one wants to see the club put at risk again but it would be good to see us punch our weight occasionally, rather than being 'gas lit' that we can't (and particularly as it seems the Benton transfer wasn't actually just about money) You say our financial performance is strong. Well our income covers our expenditure if that's what you mean. To increase the playing budget further would simply run the club into deficit or increase the level of debt through loans from the current owners (which isn't going to happen). 'Punching our weight' is exactly what the club does, not occasionally but all the time. I think there are at least 3 counters to that - if we punched our weight we'd be a national league side, with our crowds and resources that should be our level (I'll confess I prefer the NLS but anyway) - over the last decade income has consistently been higher than expenditure - above all, there is capacity in the club for income growth. The fanbase is there when the side plays well. No one wants unsustainable spending but some prudent investment (like keeping John Benton) would generate money. It isn't a zero-sum game. Our problem is more cultural than financial - the Benton transfer today was not simply about money |
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Post by jdl on Nov 15, 2024 16:43:39 GMT
Loan players rarely stay. They either get recalled, or we can't afford to buy them. It's the nature of football.
For my money, if I had to choose, I'd rather keep Paps. But we won't hang on to him either, one way or the other.
Loan players are useful - and a fact of life for many clubs. But, to succeed, and to be able to take the core of a promotion side up with us, we need to build the team round contract players. Loanees should only ever be a stop gap.
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Post by OldBoy73 on Nov 15, 2024 17:04:00 GMT
Loan players rarely stay. They either get recalled, or we can't afford to buy them. It's the nature of football. For my money, if I had to choose, I'd rather keep Paps. But we won't hang on to him either, one way or the other. Loan players are useful - and a fact of life for many clubs. But, to succeed, and to be able to take the core of a promotion side up with us, we need to build the team round contract players. Loanees should only ever be a stop gap. Its gutting when these quality loanees go but they are also often our best players and we need at least another two or three of them if the turnaround is to continue. |
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Post by pwoodstone on Nov 15, 2024 17:08:13 GMT
You say our financial performance is strong. Well our income covers our expenditure if that's what you mean. To increase the playing budget further would simply run the club into deficit or increase the level of debt through loans from the current owners (which isn't going to happen). 'Punching our weight' is exactly what the club does, not occasionally but all the time. I think there are at least 3 counters to that - if we punched our weight we'd be a national league side, with our crowds and resources that should be our level (I'll confess I prefer the NLS but anyway) - over the last decade income has consistently been higher than expenditure - above all, there is capacity in the club for income growth. The fanbase is there when the side plays well. No one wants unsustainable spending but some prudent investment (like keeping John Benton) would generate money. It isn't a zero-sum game. Our problem is more cultural than financial - the Benton transfer today was not simply about money "Punching weight" is not really measurable any more. How can one fighter be expected to compete with fighters who are doping. Our income being more than expenditure is true enough but finances are not reported at the end of a season. The line is drawn at the end of our financial year and the profits are pumped back in. It isn't as easy to say we made a profit of £50k then we have £50k more to spend next season. The culture of the club is one of sustainability. I understand why the fans see our support and think x Y and Z but spending more than the club have would likely only lead to a) another season in the NLS but the club have made a loss. b) the club have made a loss, won promotion and have a more expensive season ahead but with fewer funds. It's like buying the most expensive car you can only just afford but ignoring the fact that fuel consumption is 4 times worse and the tyres and servicing 4 times as expensive. I would imagine Benton has signed for more than a year. Are our fingers still sore from the Luque burn? |
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Post by daveu on Nov 15, 2024 17:12:04 GMT
he has signed for Boreham Wood on a permanent transfer it's pretty damning of our set up tbh we should be competing at that level, and we aren't Why is it damning. We stick to what we can afford. I think it says a lot about the way the club is run that we don’t spend money we haven’t got when we get outbid for players by sugar daddy clubs. |
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Post by Harry on Nov 15, 2024 17:31:13 GMT
You say our financial performance is strong. Well our income covers our expenditure if that's what you mean. To increase the playing budget further would simply run the club into deficit or increase the level of debt through loans from the current owners (which isn't going to happen). 'Punching our weight' is exactly what the club does, not occasionally but all the time. I think there are at least 3 counters to that - if we punched our weight we'd be a national league side, with our crowds and resources that should be our level (I'll confess I prefer the NLS but anyway) - over the last decade income has consistently been higher than expenditure - above all, there is capacity in the club for income growth. The fanbase is there when the side plays well. No one wants unsustainable spending but some prudent investment (like keeping John Benton) would generate money. It isn't a zero-sum game. Our problem is more cultural than financial - the Benton transfer today was not simply about money Well, lets look at your 'counters' It is true our crowds do equal plenty of National League sides, but not the really big clubs. Anyhow, it is really resources that drive and sustain hefty player wages and quite simply we don't compete effectively with most of National League clubs. Resources are made up of a number of ingredients, but owners subsidies play a key part. Exceptionally smaller cubs like MUFC may do ok but it is the exception not the rule. Not convinced about the fan base being much more than where we are on a regular basis. Nobody really enjoys supporting a struggling National League club, Been there, seen it, worn the tshirt. The club lost plenty in the NL last time out. Prudent investment as you say is nothing more than shelling out more money than what we bring in. That worked out well last time when we tried to stay in the NL. Its just a gamble and a desperate one at that. As for being cultural rather than financial - they are different sides of the same coin. Some supporters believe that their business acumen is greater than that of our owners. Like they know better how to run the club from a financial perspective. If that was true why are they not successful business men in their own right ready to shell out £millions of their hard earned cash ? |
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Post by edos78 on Nov 15, 2024 17:58:00 GMT
he has signed for Boreham Wood on a permanent transfer it's pretty damning of our set up tbh we should be competing at that level, and we aren't Why is it damning. We stick to what we can afford. I think it says a lot about the way the club is run that we don’t spend money we haven’t got when we get outbid for players by sugar daddy clubs. damning that we didn't get the signing done earlier - the player was at the club an initial agreement was in place we don't behave like a club of the size we are |
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Post by Raymondo316 on Nov 15, 2024 18:59:56 GMT
Loan players rarely stay. They either get recalled, or we can't afford to buy them. It's the nature of football. For my money, if I had to choose, I'd rather keep Paps. But we won't hang on to him either, one way or the other. Loan players are useful - and a fact of life for many clubs. But, to succeed, and to be able to take the core of a promotion side up with us, we need to build the team round contract players. Loanees should only ever be a stop gap. Its gutting when these quality loanees go but they are also often our best players and we need at least another two or three of them if the turnaround is to continue. Im expecting Papadopoulos to be off when his loan deal is up in January so that will be another key player who will need replacing.
You just cant rely on building a squad with loan players because they can leave at any moment.
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