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Post by hammerstone on Aug 29, 2019 6:00:33 GMT
Gents, life is over as we know it. This esteemed fellow appears in the know about opening a new auschwitz as a result of Boris
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Post by daveu on Aug 29, 2019 7:28:47 GMT
Gents, life is over as we know it. This esteemed fellow appears in the know about opening a new auschwitz as a result of Boris Bit over the top but Boris is exhibiting some of the classic behaviour of a dictator. Unlikely to be another Hitler but that doesn't make it right. Also set a dangerous precedent. What's to stop future governments suspending parliament to force through unpopular legislation.
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Post by 61666 on Aug 29, 2019 7:39:00 GMT
Listening to BoJo, Gove and Reece-Mogg made my skin crawl this morning. Had they the guts to come out and openly say they were engineering a no deal Brexit would at least have given them some credibility. Instead, they choose to continue lying about their motives, in the assumption that we don't realise what they are doing and as such, I find their arrogance utterly astonishing. Maybe No Deal will work out fine and we will all be better off, even though most expert opinions seem to think otherwise. In a way,I hope so, but cannot have any faith in a regime that is constructing a coup d'etat, cleverly (though it pains me to say it) timed to deny any opposition to it. And yet they completely deny this is what they have done because, even more worrying, it is all about preparing for a new golden age of opportunity, post Brexit. Check your history folks, because isn't this what all revolutionary dictatorships offer? For me, this is the biggest problem with what BJ et al are doing and the brazen lies are what is so unpalatable. Am sure conspiracy theorists will have a field day, but one thing certainly stands out among the promises. 20 000 extra police. Is that really to crack down on crime, or to deal with the inevitable unrest that will follow? Not my prediction, but in the government's own report leaked just a couple of weeks ago. Scary times, I'm afraid.
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Post by Nick on Aug 29, 2019 8:31:27 GMT
You do paint an extremely gloomy picture 61666. Do you really believe that the present UK Government is the rotting, corrupt corpse that you describe ? Do you really believe that the honourable BoJo with his record of truth, honestly and integrity, could act in such a despicable fashion ? Do you really believe that the country's parliamentary democracy is now firmly subservient to the will of these splendid people who support the Leave cause ? Do you really believe that so many our fellow Brits have been manipulated and deceived by a bunch of corrupt and lying politicians ? I'm afraid to say 61666 that you may as well go with flow, after all you lost !
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Post by daveu on Aug 29, 2019 9:34:42 GMT
Millions of Germans went with the flow in the 1930s. That work out well!
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Post by davec on Aug 29, 2019 10:04:52 GMT
Millions of Germans went with the flow in the 1930s. That work out well! I think it was 17.4 million
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Post by toonarmy on Aug 29, 2019 10:19:11 GMT
Millions of Germans went with the flow in the 1930s. That work out well! I think it is truly crass to compare what is happening in the UK at the moment to what occurred in Germany in the 1930's, there is simply no comparison and people need to calm down, whilst what is happening isn't ideal it is unfortunately the path we were put on when the majority of people voted to leave the EU, there was only a simple question back then and it was do want to remain in the EU yes or no, there was nothing about what if we didn't sort a deal out, it was a simple question, what has made this situation even more depressing is the fact we have got absolutely nowhere in 3 years and parliament haven't helped, when we needed them to be strong whilst we were trying to negotiate with the EU there were far to many voices saying we shouldn't leave the EU without a deal and then passing various legislation to try and stop this, which has played into the EU hands and they believe we will take anything they offer hence Theresa May's agreement and Boris doing what he has done, which will make the EU sit up' well I hope so and we can sort out a deal of some sort. before people jump on me and say I am one of those so called idiots who voted to leave, I am not I voted to remain but whilst some of my fellow remain voters have forgotten all about democracy and have bleated since the result, I have accepted the majority have voted to leave and that is what we should do (However I would prefer a deal)
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Post by 61666 on Aug 29, 2019 10:57:21 GMT
You do paint an extremely gloomy picture 61666. Do you really believe that the present UK Government is the rotting, corrupt corpse that you describe ? Do you really believe that the honourable BoJo with his record of truth, honestly and integrity, could act in such a despicable fashion ? Do you really believe that the country's parliamentary democracy is now firmly subservient to the will of these splendid people who support the Leave cause ? Do you really believe that so many our fellow Brits have been manipulated and deceived by a bunch of corrupt and lying politicians ? I'm afraid to say 61666 that you may as well go with flow, after all you lost ! Yes
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Post by 61666 on Aug 29, 2019 11:00:54 GMT
Yes to all of it. Latest YouGov poll says only half of those who voted leave think BoJo s scam is good and likewise only half of those who voted Tory. So, less than a quarter of the electorate, which is close to three fifths of five eights of fuckall. Democracy you say....
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Post by Better things to do in life on Aug 29, 2019 11:10:59 GMT
Millions of Germans went with the flow in the 1930s. That work out well! I think it is truly crass to compare what is happening in the UK at the moment to what occurred in Germany in the 1930's, there is simply no comparison and people need to calm down, whilst what is happening isn't ideal it is unfortunately the path we were put on when the majority of people voted to leave the EU, there was only a simple question back then and it was do want to remain in the EU yes or no, there was nothing about what if we didn't sort a deal out, it was a simple question, what has made this situation even more depressing is the fact we have got absolutely nowhere in 3 years and parliament haven't helped, when we needed them to be strong whilst we were trying to negotiate with the EU there were far to many voices saying we shouldn't leave the EU without a deal and then passing various legislation to try and stop this, which has played into the EU hands and they believe we will take anything they offer hence Theresa May's agreement hence Boris doing what he has done, which will make the EU sit up' well I hope so and we can sort out a deal of some sort. before people jump on me and say I am one of those so called idiots who voted to leave, I am not I voted to remain but whilst some of my fellow remain voters have forgotten all about democracy and have bleated since the result, I have accepted the majority have voted to leave and that is what we should do (However I would prefer a deal) A rare and very welcome voice of sanity from the Remain camp who accept the referendum result. Thank you Toon! Also, how come no-one has shown concern about the threat to British democracy when the Speaker of the House - by the Constitution and by tradition a NEUTRAL and acquiescent and conciliatory force in British Politics, decided to throw that democracy and tradition in the bin and dictate the course of British Politics himself. Bercow and "his" parliament, and their self-appointed dictatorship over, and in ignorance of, the will of the people for three long years is the real threat to democracy that Boris is having to mitigate. Before anyone attacks Boris for being "unconstitutional", or making ridiculous comparisons with Nazi Germany, please look at Bercow's throwing the Constitution under a bus and an elected parliament who refuse to fulfil the will of the people who elected them - that's where the true makings of a dictatorship lie.
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Post by daveu on Aug 29, 2019 11:16:05 GMT
I think it is truly crass to compare what is happening in the UK at the moment to what occurred in Germany in the 1930's, there is simply no comparison and people need to calm down, whilst what is happening isn't ideal it is unfortunately the path we were put on when the majority of people voted to leave the EU, there was only a simple question back then and it was do want to remain in the EU yes or no, there was nothing about what if we didn't sort a deal out, it was a simple question, what has made this situation even more depressing is the fact we have got absolutely nowhere in 3 years and parliament haven't helped, when we needed them to be strong whilst we were trying to negotiate with the EU there were far to many voices saying we shouldn't leave the EU without a deal and then passing various legislation to try and stop this, which has played into the EU hands and they believe we will take anything they offer hence Theresa May's agreement hence Boris doing what he has done, which will make the EU sit up' well I hope so and we can sort out a deal of some sort. before people jump on me and say I am one of those so called idiots who voted to leave, I am not I voted to remain but whilst some of my fellow remain voters have forgotten all about democracy and have bleated since the result, I have accepted the majority have voted to leave and that is what we should do (However I would prefer a deal) A rare and very welcome voice of sanity from the Remain camp who accept the referendum result. Thank you Toon! Also, how come no-one has shown concern about the threat to British democracy when the Speaker of the House - by the Constitution and by tradition a NEUTRAL and acquiescent and conciliatory force in British Politics, decided to throw that democracy and tradition in the bin and dictate the course of British Politics himself. Bercow and "his" parliament, and their self-appointed dictatorship over, and in ignorance of, the will of the people for three long years is the real threat to democracy that Boris is having to mitigate. Before anyone attacks Boris for being "unconstitutional", or making ridiculous comparisons with Nazi Germany, please look at Bercow's throwing the Constitution under a bus and an elected parliament who refuse to fulfil the will of the people who elected them - that's where the true makings of a dictatorship lie. Funny how it's only ever a voice of reason when you agree with it.
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Post by 1018 on Aug 29, 2019 13:14:44 GMT
I think it is truly crass to compare what is happening in the UK at the moment to what occurred in Germany in the 1930's, there is simply no comparison and people need to calm down, whilst what is happening isn't ideal it is unfortunately the path we were put on when the majority of people voted to leave the EU, there was only a simple question back then and it was do want to remain in the EU yes or no, there was nothing about what if we didn't sort a deal out, it was a simple question, what has made this situation even more depressing is the fact we have got absolutely nowhere in 3 years and parliament haven't helped, when we needed them to be strong whilst we were trying to negotiate with the EU there were far to many voices saying we shouldn't leave the EU without a deal and then passing various legislation to try and stop this, which has played into the EU hands and they believe we will take anything they offer hence Theresa May's agreement hence Boris doing what he has done, which will make the EU sit up' well I hope so and we can sort out a deal of some sort. before people jump on me and say I am one of those so called idiots who voted to leave, I am not I voted to remain but whilst some of my fellow remain voters have forgotten all about democracy and have bleated since the result, I have accepted the majority have voted to leave and that is what we should do (However I would prefer a deal) A rare and very welcome voice of sanity from the Remain camp who accept the referendum result. Thank you Toon! Also, how come no-one has shown concern about the threat to British democracy when the Speaker of the House - by the Constitution and by tradition a NEUTRAL and acquiescent and conciliatory force in British Politics, decided to throw that democracy and tradition in the bin and dictate the course of British Politics himself. Bercow and "his" parliament, and their self-appointed dictatorship over, and in ignorance of, the will of the people for three long years is the real threat to democracy that Boris is having to mitigate. Before anyone attacks Boris for being "unconstitutional", or making ridiculous comparisons with Nazi Germany, please look at Bercow's throwing the Constitution under a bus and an elected parliament who refuse to fulfil the will of the people who elected them - that's where the true makings of a dictatorship lie. Two excellent Posts which I totally agree with. Although I voted to Remain I now believe that Leaving is the only option. DaveU appears to be representative of those who can't/won't accept the Referendum result. Those of us who hail from north of Watford can fully understand why people voted to Leave. The Remainers just need to grow up and accept it.
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Post by Nick on Aug 29, 2019 13:15:21 GMT
What I find most disappointing is how blinkered some of my fellow and apparently decent Brits are behaving at the moment.
I have listened with no little sympathy when they have championed the sovereignty of parliament as a primary driver for leaving the EU.
These same people are now championing the tactics of our populist BoJo in seeking to deny parliamentarians from holding the government to account.
Trumpism gone mad when intolerance, prejudice, dishonestly and bigotry are paraded daily as being somehow virtuous and justifiable.
But it seems we just have to 'grow up' and 'accept it'.
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Post by daveu on Aug 29, 2019 13:47:09 GMT
A rare and very welcome voice of sanity from the Remain camp who accept the referendum result. Thank you Toon! Also, how come no-one has shown concern about the threat to British democracy when the Speaker of the House - by the Constitution and by tradition a NEUTRAL and acquiescent and conciliatory force in British Politics, decided to throw that democracy and tradition in the bin and dictate the course of British Politics himself. Bercow and "his" parliament, and their self-appointed dictatorship over, and in ignorance of, the will of the people for three long years is the real threat to democracy that Boris is having to mitigate. Before anyone attacks Boris for being "unconstitutional", or making ridiculous comparisons with Nazi Germany, please look at Bercow's throwing the Constitution under a bus and an elected parliament who refuse to fulfil the will of the people who elected them - that's where the true makings of a dictatorship lie. Two excellent Posts which I totally agree with. Although I voted to Remain I now believe that Leaving is the only option. DaveU appears to be representative of those who can't/won't accept the Referendum result. Those of us who hail from north of Watford can fully understand why people voted to Leave. The Remainers just need to grow up and accept it. I would accept the referendum result however dishonesty achieved if what we were getting was what was voted for. Of the options discussed prior to the referendum, no deal wasn't even among them. But even then, it's not actually the no deal Brexit I'm complaint about, it's Boris' flagrant abuse of our Constitution to force through an unpopular policy. If parliament had voted through a no deal Brexit then that's what we should have, but forcing it through is not only sticking two fingers up at democracy, but sets a dangerous precedent for the future when the next government with an unpopular policy decides to follow Boris' example.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2019 14:41:16 GMT
Two excellent Posts which I totally agree with. Although I voted to Remain I now believe that Leaving is the only option. DaveU appears to be representative of those who can't/won't accept the Referendum result. Those of us who hail from north of Watford can fully understand why people voted to Leave. The Remainers just need to grow up and accept it. I would accept the referendum result however dishonesty achieved if what we were getting was what was voted for. Of the options discussed prior to the referendum, no deal wasn't even among them. But even then, it's not actually the no deal Brexit I'm complaint about, it's Boris' flagrant abuse of our Constitution to force through an unpopular policy. If parliament had voted through a no deal Brexit then that's what we should have, but forcing it through is not only sticking two fingers up at democracy, but sets a dangerous precedent for the future when the next government with an unpopular policy decides to follow Boris' example. Er, the nation voted to leave, we are leaving, so we can all assume you do accept the referendum result.
Secondly, you once said that as soon as someone mentions Hitler, a conversation is over - so, please admin lock this thread now because DaveU has ruined it for everyone.
(Sits back and waits for the long haired angry bloke to come right back at me with some convaluted bullshit about "that's not what I said, man!")
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